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Last Post 24-05-2013 3:56 PM by  Ty (ACO Leicestershire)
The importance of nebulisers.
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Ann Conway
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17-11-2012 7:01 AM

    We have had three birds in the last week all  go down with  a  very sudden onset   breathing difficulties, accompanied by tail bobbing.

    Thankfully they have all recovered and are now back to normal after being nebulised immediately.

    Nebulisers can be bought online from as little  as £30. Lidl had some on offer for £20 recently.

    They can make a real difference between the  life and death of a bird in this type of emergency.

    Birds can be nebulised with F10 SC , dilution is 1ml - F10  to 250mils- water.

    Please ensure you use only the F10 SC , and not the F10 disinfectant.

    We  would   advise anyone who keeps  birds to purchase  a nebuliser and the F10 SC  as an essential part of  their first aid kit. 

    Rescue Manager North & Aco for Cumbria.
    Debs
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    17-11-2012 7:18 AM
    Yes as Ann has said Nebulisers are a cheap and essential part of a birdie first Aid Kit. If you don't own one then at least make sure you know where you can lay your hands on one in an emergency until you do get one :-)

    There was a certain amount of confusion over which F10 product could be used in the nebuliser last time this subject was mentioned so I can I just clarify. it is the F10SC which is safe to use in a nebuliser (diluted). It IS a disnfectant and can be used for a wide range of cleaning tasks as well, so it is very handy to have regardless of whether you currently have a nebuliser. it is the F10SCXD which you can NOT use in the nebuliser. The F10SCXD is the same as the F10SC but it has a detergent and additional cleaning agents added and is therefore UNSAFE in the nebuliser!

    If all the letters confuse you then just remember it is the clear one that you can use and the green one that you can't use! :-)

    nigel
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    18-11-2012 1:37 AM

    Thanks Ann and Debs for your post, as someone who does not have a nebulizer to hand I shall now put this right, I have only one bird so my need of one is comparatively low compared with others who have flocks or safehouse, however, my previous TAG of some years ago was lost and his first symptoms were breathing difficulties, I know that the end could not have been any different but in hind sight it may have just been a bit helpful to him in that awful period of getting him to the vet, I also think that even if I never have use of it (hopefully!) it will be here for anyone who should need one in an emergency.

    Ann and Debs, could you explain a little more on why these birds would suddenly experience breathing difficulties and why the appropriate F10 is helpful? I am guessing it is to do with problems with fungal spores or similar air borne problems.

    Thanks for a helpful post and can it be made a sticky?

    Sometimes....priorities have to be reviewed!
    HelenC
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    18-11-2012 2:19 AM
    Bird less at the minute but hopefully soon to be a fostered and or safe house I ordered my nebuliser and appropriate F10 last night from amazon via easy fundraising, doing by bit for birdline on all levels hopefully
    Helen😃🐣🐾🙈🙉🙊
    Debs
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    20-11-2012 2:56 AM
    Nigel - Why birds suddenly experience breathing difficulties is a very complex matter. It could be the onset of a major illness (often this is the first obvious outward sign of a problem if owners have overlooked some of the more easily missed signs like lethargy). It could be that the bird has come into contact with aspergillus fungal spores which could cause aspergillosis. Or it could simply be that something has aggravated the birds airsac linings (elderly aunt visiting with overpowering perfume...LOL). Either way quick treatment will help and depending on the cause can save lives.

    Birds breathing is very different to mammals. They do not have lungs they have airsacs and the linings of the airsacs can become inflammed making it difficult to beathe. It is also an ideal place for fungal spores to grow and take hold as the airsacs are a nice warm dark area in which a fungus will thrive.

    Nebulisers work primarily in 'opening' the airways to make breathing easier. In much the same way as inhaling steam does when you have a blocked nose from a cold. Which is why those without a nebuliser are advised to take the bird into a bathroom with the hot taps running. Nebulisers are also used by asthma suffers for exactly the same reasons. The additional benefit of using the CORRECT F10 product is (as you have said) that it is extremely effective against aspergillus spores and other airborne nasties (if you want more info on F10 products then they have their own website which is extremely informative).
    Ann Conway
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    20-11-2012 4:11 AM
    Personally I also tend to feel that with the onset of winter, central heating being put back on, and people closing their windows more, inadequate ventilation may also contribute to some problems we are seeing.
    Rescue Manager North & Aco for Cumbria.
    SharonL
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    20-11-2012 10:16 AM
    Hear hear Ann. Overcrowding, poor venitiation, central heating and rooms with damp problems all contribute to breathing probelms. Our windows are open every morning rain or shine for fresh air and the birds go out every day that the weather conditions will allow even just for 10 minutes. I have a one third share in a nebuliser that Chris, Sharon H and I have bought. We are in the process of making sure a complete 'kit' is with it. Sterilised water pods, F10SC, a suitable carrier and cover a 1ml syringe to measure F10 and 5ml cup to measure water and laminated instructions. This way, should we need it it is ready to go. WIth 5 birds, chances are at some point I will need it. Great to know it is there. I am looking for a second hand 12v/battery one too so that when we holiday and therefore cannot use our 240volt one that we have one to hand. 12v also good for using on a bird going to the vets. We are lucky, a brill avian vet 30 mins away but even that could make all the difference.
    Until one has loved an animal, part of their soul remains unawakened
    amanda marsden
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    20-11-2012 10:25 AM
    can i ask ,would it be help full to birds to nebulise say weekley even if theres no problems ,or is it just something you would do if there was a problem
    SharonL
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    20-11-2012 10:48 AM
    Only if the is a problem Amanda.
    Until one has loved an animal, part of their soul remains unawakened
    amanda marsden
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    20-11-2012 1:44 PM
    ok thanks,i dont have one at mo ,but going to get one
    nigel
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    20-11-2012 4:38 PM

    Thanks Debs, Ann and Sharon for your really helpful information, as I posted previously, I wish I had had one with a previous bird (prior to me even knowing of Birdline!) because of this and your advice I have now bought one which arrived today, hopefully we will not need it, Danny doesn't come into contact with other birds and spends a lot of time in the fresh air with me at work, weather permitting and we don't do closed windows in our house!
    The make and model is: "Compressor Nebuliser 'CompMist' from Mabis Healthcare" and bought off good old ebay, I will also follow your advice on the "kit" to go with it and am happy to make it available to anyone in my area of Essex who should need one in an emergency.

    Just a thought Sharon re a 12 volt one, it may be worth looking at an inverter (try ebay!) this would allow you to use a 240 volt nebulizer in a car, wouldn't need to be a big inverter as a nebulizer would draw little power.

    Thanks again.

    PS just had a look and there are a lot of cigarette plug in inverters on ebay for about £15 up.

    Sometimes....priorities have to be reviewed!
    Doug
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    20-11-2012 5:04 PM

    Apologies as this is my first post, but it caught my eye. I'll do a proper intro post tomorrow

    Just wanted to question F10SC, Ive had a nebuliser for a while and use this: F10 Antiseptic Solution. I use the F10SC too but only for general cleaning. Do F10 actually say the F10SC is suitable for nebulising ?

    Just thought Id mention it as they do specifically state that the Antiseptic Solution is for nebulising etc.

    On another note, "ultrasonic" nebulisers are almost silent, compared to compressor driven ones, they are more expensive though. Not sure how sentitive birds are to the sound (I originally got mine for my rats), but its perhaps another consideration - I got mine from Maplin.

    Debs
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    20-11-2012 5:18 PM
    Hi Doug and welcome

    The antiseptic solution is fine to use in a nebuliser and is also used to apply directly to wounds. However the F10SC is also as good and is what is actually prescribed by vets!

    Now I know the reason for this as I had cause to speak to F10 Biocare earlier this year and the reason is this....The F10SC has always been ok to use as a treatment. However due to an EU ruling any item that is used as a treatment must specify 'ingredients/contents'. The F10SC didn't have any such label and as such they couldn't 'advertise' it as a treatment. Due to them having to develop a whole new label with 'ingredients/contents' on they decided to market it as a 'treatment' hence calling it an antiseptic. It is in actual fact the same as F10SC but I believe it is dearer which is why vets continue to prescribe the F10SC

    Or at least this is what I was told by F10 themselves and this was confirmed by my vet who had had a similar conversation with them.
    SharonL
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    20-11-2012 9:24 PM
    Thanks for that Nigel. I will do some research. Mapliins do a portable one that has been recommended to a member by their avian vet. It is 12v/battery, but the battery is sold seperately. Inverter may be an option.

    As the powers that be are now recommending a neb as an essential part of a bird owners first aid kit, could they please follow mine, Sharon H's and Chris's lead by making available on the website, a detailed information sheet about nebulisers/nebulising ?
    Until one has loved an animal, part of their soul remains unawakened
    SharonH
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    21-11-2012 4:36 AM
    Well said Sharon. I wondered if that part of the training course could be put on on information leaflet. Actually I'd like to see part of the website as information/fact sheets.
    Doug
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    21-11-2012 9:42 AM
    Very interesting to know Debs, thank you for clarifying that.
    I'll just buy the SC from now on then

    +1 for putting together a fact sheet, great idea.
    Pamazon
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    26-01-2013 2:50 AM
    I'm so pleased to read all these helpful hints. I must buy a nebuliseer too as I have a bird with breathing problems. I'm not sure which one to get. Can I use a hand-held one which comes with a mask, or do you let the mist just come out where the bird is, like the dehumidifier I use when the central heating comes on. I can also get the F10SC at the same time. I wish I had had one a couple of weeks ago. Many thanks for your help

    Pam
    Pamazon
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    26-01-2013 3:44 AM
    Ooops, I meant 'humidifier' in my earlier post, not 'de-humidifier'!
    SharonL
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    26-01-2013 5:45 AM
    Has a fact sheet on correct use of a nubuliser been put up on the site yet???? Will pop off and have a look. If so, it would be good to print off and keep with the nebuliser so clear instructions are available.

    I did go ahead and get a battery neb. I could not see a second hand one for a reasonable second hand price, so instead bought an ultrasonic Omron MicroAir. They retail at around £90 but there are plenty available on Ebay for £50 Bryan's mom bought it us for Xmas. It is tiny and runs on aa batteries which last a very respectable time. It is also easy to strap it onto the side of a travel cage, or in my case I have opted to use Norm's Pak O Bird as it is easy to roll down the sides and front cover and is always to hand.

    Good thread to keep bumping for anyone who is unaware of the importance on nubulisers.
    Until one has loved an animal, part of their soul remains unawakened
    Debs
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    26-01-2013 12:32 PM
    Posted By Pamazon on 26-01-2013 02:50 AM
    I'm so pleased to read all these helpful hints. I must buy a nebuliseer too as I have a bird with breathing problems. I'm not sure which one to get. Can I use a hand-held one which comes with a mask, or do you let the mist just come out where the bird is, like the dehumidifier I use when the central heating comes on. I can also get the F10SC at the same time. I wish I had had one a couple of weeks ago. Many thanks for your help

    Pam


    I have known people use the mask, as they had birds that were completely happy to sit there and 'hang' their head over the mask. On the whole I would tend to think most birds would panic about this and that in itself could worsen their condition. Much better I think to pop the bird in a small cage (travel cage is ideal) and place the tube in the bottom of the cage. Cover the cage to keep the vapour in (and the bird calm) and they will be breathing it in :-)
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